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These numbers are just stupid. Vandy is harder to get into now than half the Ivys.
Zero chance I get in now. I said that five years ago too though haha!
But but it's harder for athletes to get into Tennessee than Vanderbilt
follow me on twitter @country_cookin
I know you are joking, which is funny! But in all seriousness, Tennessee did have the highest academic standards in the SEC for athletes. I believe that is going to change now that the balance of powers have been switched up again. That being said, how do you guys feel about athletes getting in at Vanderbilt, that might tarnish the academic prestige of your degrees from there? Or better yet, do you guys even feel like that is happening? I know for years anyone could get into Tennessee, and all a football player had to do was spell his name right. It's not like that anymore, and the academic standards are raising every year. Tennessee is still no Vanderbilt, and I believe it never will be, but its not the glorified community college that it once was.
I don't believe athletes tarnish the academic prestige of our degrees. There are ~6800 undergraduate students and athletes comprise a miniscule proportion of that.
Jtex, it isn't like Vanderbilt just started making exceptions for athletes over the past couple of years. It's been going on for awhile, and it's only being brought out now because Vandy's football program has experienced some success. I don't see anything being tarnished. If they graduate, and 94% of the football team does then I don't see any issue with it.
I'm sorry but I find this very hard to believe. Who was the kid that was denied admissions to Florida yet admitted to Tennessee? Dante Phillips?
It's cases like that that hurt your argument.
Not an argument, a fact. You are referring to Omari Phillips and that was a unique situation. Typically what happens is there is a gentlemen's agreement between the AD and the president, where 3-5 blue chip prospects who are on the fringe get "ok'd" by the president every year so long as the coach makes sure the players maintain a certain standard of academic performance. There was a player 2 years ago by the name of Kendrick Loften who was cleared by the NCAA clearing house, but was denied admission by Chancellor Jimmy Cheek (not a fan favorite). Tennessee is one of a few schools in the SEC who have standards on top of what the SEC and NCAA set. I'm not positive which other schools have these standards, but I know they have served as a detriment to attracting big name coaches to Tennessee and also played a role in the downfall of Fulmer.
Fair enough! My thought was that these athletes are getting into a school that they wouldn't have as a regular student, thus bringing down the standard of academic excellence that all the other students work so hard to maintain.
Jtex87 did you say earlier you're a Vol and an alum? What does that mean, are you a Vandy grad?
This post was edited by BNV212 13 months ago
I think it is a bit mistaken to say that "exceptions" are made for athletes at Vanderbilt, because grades & test scores are not the only dimension by which admissions decisions are made. Moreover there aren't any explicit cut-offs for admissions. For instance, a nationally-recruited flutist may be admitted to Vanderbilt, despite having lower test scores than the median accepted student.
This isn't an argument, it's a statement that quite frankly no one else believes. When you admit Cordarrelle Patterson who doesn't graduate a single class and who NFL executives are careful not to say "he's a risk because he's illiterate" these statements become impossible to swallow. In addition, UT's graduation rate is 61% for football players which is 4th worst in the SEC and 4% lower than the national average.
This post was edited by DanBNash 13 months ago
Ok that's fine! I'm not trying to start an argument. CP is a different case because of the junior college route. Also, I'm an alum of Tennessee. Wouldn't of minded a degree from Vanderbilt though! That graduation percentage is skewed because of the coaching turnover and transfers. My point was, Tennessee has suffered in recruiting the past several years because of higher academic standards for athletes who are coming straight from high school. This was also a major issue with Charlie Strong, and Mike "I'm a man" Gundy.
I don't think transfers affect graduation rates...
But I could be wrong.
Explain UTs APR then, which is of the lowest in the SEC.
It does effect the APR. That's my explanation. There was only one recruit left from Lane Kiffin's top 10 class his first year. That killed Tennessee's APR.
This post was edited by Jtex87 13 months ago
Nope, that's not a mistake. That's common terminology for every SEC team. I really just wanted to know if you guys were ok with lesser students getting full rides to Vanderbilt.
Jtex -- I think you ask a fair question for someone not real familiar with Vanderbilt students and grads through the years. Vandy takes its share of athletes who may not have the highest ACT or SAT scores, though many of them have had good scores; some of them are at Vandy because of the broadened course selection that the Peabody division offers. But the measure of an athlete is his total body of work after he graduates.
Many Vandy athletes from all sports have gone on to great careers, where they are among the very best in their professions. If you watch the Masters golf tournament coming up, you will see that the starter is Toby Wilt, a 3-yr first string football player who was in my class at Vandy. He became wealthy as an investment banker. Other athletes from that class became successful doctors and lawyers and engineers.
Every time I watch women's basketball on TV and see the articulate Carolyn Peck talking, and every time I watch men's basketball on TV and see the articulate Barry Booker talking, I am proud of my university's athletes. I could give you many more examples, but you get the point.
The kids who come to play at Vanderbilt are in most cases great human beings who play hard, study hard, love their school and their teammates, and go on to become contributors in our society, whether it's through helping people or practicing a profession. I'm sure other schools have success stories, but my aim here is to answer your question by saying I am proud to be represented by the athletes, including football players, graduating from Vanderbilt.
Thanks for your question and your gracious attitude.
I just don't understand why I love Vandy soo much!!! I wanna meet all the players :-)
Electi a Deo. Pugnans dæmonium. Domine fortitudo mea, non timebo mala.
Dev -- You're a great asset to Vandy and this board.
Thank you for your response! +1 very well said and provides excellent insight into a vandy grads perspective on their student athletes. You guys have had 2 great years and seem to be pulling in top recruits. My thoughts are if you continue to have success the pool of recruits vandy signs will be more diverse, perhaps letting in a few bad eggs. As the stage gets bigger, more potential problems will arise.
We appreciate your concern.
Jtex87, I was trying to make a nuanced semantic point, but you didn't seem to follow. Anyway, as long as our athletes continue to graduate at a very high rate (#1 in SEC by a mile), represent the university well on and off the field, and do great things as alumni (even if they "go pro in something other than sports"), then I don't consider them "lesser students".
I gathered that :). Arguing over what words mean.
I agree that if Vandy's success continues, and more elite athletes with very marginal academic qualifications want to attend Vanderbilt, there may be a temptation to put aside the rules in a few cases. But more likely, in my opinion, is that enough 4* and 5* athletes with decent credentials will become interested that putting aside the rules won't be necessary. Also, a coach at Vandy knows going in that an unqualified player is not likely to be around very long anyway.
There are plenty of good students at traditional powers; if Vandy becomes an established winning program, many students like that will be willing to look more seriously at Vandy.
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